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[WIP] Full Throttle

 

Hello everyone,

 

Since my return, I’ve been browsing the forum for updates. One topic that comes up regularly is the problem of the fragility of Light Vehicles in the Heroes System. In fact, when I discuss it with you or look at the armies played in tournaments, Light Vehicles are played very little because they have a hard time surviving the first few rounds of the game. Troop transports are an exception and seen more often, but they often just serve as kamikaze vehicles: players move them as far as possible, disembark troops on an advantageous position and sacrifice their transport vehicle, preferably making it a shield or a barricade to block a passage… it’s a good and fun tactic, but it’s not very realistic.

 

This is all the more unfortunate
as Light Vehicles are one of the three main unit types of the
Heroes System.

As some of you may know, Devil Pig Games is listening to the feedback from its community and has regularly updated the Heroes System by incorporating comments or changes from fan rules when it helped improve the game.

So Yann, Clem and I have been working on this Light Vehicle issue. The goal: to find a simple rule, using existing mechanics, preferably with a Hollywood touch, allowing you to get your Light Vehicles out of the garage. A red line not to be crossed: this rule should not require reprinting Light Vehicles or their Recruitment Options… it’s a simple question of not making Light Vehicles obsolete.

Today, I have the dangerous privilege of presenting this rule to you and seeking your opinion:

 

Full Throttle

A unit receives a Full Throttle marker when it moves 5 or more spaces during its Movement Action, without passing through the same space twice. When activated, this fast-moving unit keeps the Full Throttle marker as long as it performs a Movement Action with the aforementioned conditions, otherwise the Full Throttle marker is discarded.

A unit with a Full Throttle marker:
● Can perform Firing Actions (with the Fire on the Move special ability), and can be the
target of a Firing Action. In both cases the long range penalty applies, starting beyond 3
squares.
● Can perform Assaults as normal.
● Cannot be the target of Assaults.
● Cannot perform Alternate Firing Actions.
● Cannot be embarked.
● Cannot be disembarked.
Units inside a vehicle with a Full Throttle marker:
● Cannot perform Firing Actions.

Modification of the Ace Driver special ability.
In addition to the existing rules, a light vehicle with the Ace Driver special ability has the advantages of a Full Throttle marker but does not suffer the corresponding disadvantages.

Please note that this applies to the light vehicle and not to any units on board or wishing to board the vehicle.

 

Note: the Full Throttle rule applies not only to Light Vehicles but to all units with a Movement Value of 5 or more… limiting it to Light Vehicles seemed artificial to us. We checked the units that would benefit from this rule, there should be no side effect…

At this stage, this is not yet an official rule.
We are submitting it to you for discussion.

 

If it is made official, it will be added to the Compendium’s Additional Rules (such as Moral, Fire, Weather Conditions, …ace driver). It would therefore be an optional rule unless you overwhelmingly request that it be included in the main body of the rules. This officialization could simply take the form of a downloadable PDF with most likely one scenario per Heroes
System WWII range (HoN, SoN, HoS) to honor light vehicles.

It could also take the form of a card printed in a product around light vehicles. I won’t tell you more about this at this point. I prefer to let you fantasize about what this product could be. We
know you’ll love it.

Again, I’m listening to your opinions. Feel free to test it out before making any returns.

Guillaume


posted by gduprez the [25/05/2020]


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20 Comments on “[WIP] Full Throttle”

  1. 20. NoelG said :

    Gulliver’s house rule sounds perfect and it keeps things consistent within the rules.

  2. 19. kakita horiuko said :

    Mes deux sous.

    Les véhicules légers sont, dans leur majorité, des véhicules de transport type camion ou jeep.
    Ce ne sont pas des véhicules de combat, qu’ils n’y soit pas adaptés (id est fragiles) ne me choque pas.
    Il est peut être envisageable de réviser la classe de certains véhicules, mais changer la règle ne me semble pas souhaitable.

  3. 18. krultan said :

    I really like the house rule of Guilver. We tried it today and it works perfect. Maybe this rule should be added to the core rules since it is easy to understand. I found the Full Throttle rule too complicated compared to the level of complexity of the current HoN ruleset.

  4. 17. Guilver said :

    The way we play it is to use the same second roll like with heavy vehicles.

    1 – Crew: Can’t fire weapon {Maybe one person – gunner is down and can only drive and move)
    2 – Tracks: Tracks or wheels – Can’t move.{Can still fire weapon though even though wheels are shot out/blown out}
    3/4 – Hull: 2 Suppression markers {Makes sense. Can’t shoot, nor move much. Will take a couple of turns to remove, but maybe won’t last that long anyway?}
    5 – Primary weapon {Only one weapon so can’t shoot. Can still move though}
    6 – Destruction {Blown up. Makes sense}

    If the light vehicle gets hit a second time, it is destroyed.

    I like the full throttle counter, and I think we could use it to expand the abilities.

  5. 16. Ustasha said :

    I love your arguement, point and solution! We used it last night and we found that it worked very well in our games. By far the best solution tried and tested so far. Thank you and good gaming.

  6. 15. Grizzledveteran said :

    I guess this could work… I’m not sure I the idea of all the vehicles driving around really fast all the time just to get this bonus. It seems silly.

    My group just plays light vehicles differently to make them worth playing. If a light vehicle takes a hit from a unit that has an X for its attack bonus against heavy vehicles. The light vehicle is damaged. A damaged light vehicle does not roll for the damage effect like a heavy vehicle does. Instead, it receives a suppression marker that is never removed unless the repairs card is used. This way, light vehicles are no longer in danger of going up in flames instantly from a lucky shot from a fire team.

    I remember the first time played a Greyhound for my Americans and I was so excited. Turn 1 my opponent as a fire group take a pot shot and a 6 comes up. Boom. That was fun…

  7. 14. BRUCOS69 said :

    “Appliquer la règles des dégâts des véhicules lourd aux véhicules légers.”
    Si on accorde la possibilité de faire un jet de localisation des dégâts aux VL, on part dans une confusion entre blindés légers et véhicules légers..
    La solution plein gaz prive de l’attrait des VL à savoir tir en mouvement, puis à quoi cela sert d’avancer plein pot si au final on ne peut pas déposer les troupes et les VL ont déjà les meilleurs capacités de mouvement dans le jeu, si on commence à calculer le nb de cases parcourues cela devient ennuyant…. on perd en fluidité à mon humble avis..
    pour rester positive car il y a un soucis je propose ceci :
    – Option d’ordonnance : « Tradition mécanisée» cette ordonnance donnerait 3 ou 4 marqueurs réservés aux VL : 1er marqueur :+2 en protection, 2e marqueur : -2 aux tirs adverses et 3e marqueur : Tir d’opportunité impossible contre ce VL 4e marqueur : +2 en mouvement ou bien “Tradition mécanisée” pourrait être d’acheter une option liée à une tuile de commandement et cette option pourrait être de donner +1 (ou +2) en défense à tous les VL
    et/ou
    Option de matériel : rajouter un « Additional shielding » qui serait réservé aux VL avec 3 marqueurs +2 ; (histoire d’étoffer les protections mais en rendant cela limité à des marqueurs, avec la possibilité de les cumuler sur un même tir subi))
    et/ou
    – Trait de caractère « PZ Grenadiers » ou « Mechanized infantry » soit les unités sortant des VL de transport bénéficient d’un +1 en assaut et +1 en mouvement. histoire de rendre plus sexy les halftrack et Sdkfz

  8. 13. Romator35 said :

    Bonjour à tous,
    La question de fragilité des véhicules léger et effectivement un problème qui fait qu’on ne les jouent que très rarement.
    Je ne pense pas que la règle plein gaz soit la meilleur solution car la fragilité du véhicule léger demeure…
    Par contre la proposition de thia74 me semble plus simple (on à déjà les pions pour les marqueurs dégâts ,)la plus cohérente et réalisable car juste à rajouter une règle.
    Pour moi Thia à apporté la meilleure solution afin de redonner de l’intérêt afin de redéployer nos véhicules léger dans les parties.
    Bonne journée et bon jeu à tous.

  9. 12. gduprez said :

    That’s right.

  10. 11. buqbuq said :

    If a light vehicle moves 6 squares, it get a token after it moves 5 squares.

    On the next turn, the light vehicle continues its movement with the token for 3 squares. The player declares no further movement, then it looses a token.

    But if it moves with the token for 5 squares or more, it keeps the token.

    Is it right?

  11. 10. beleg01 said :

    Toutes nouvelles règles sont bonnes à prendre si c’est pour améliorer le jeu de base.
    Les tests aussi sont importants (pour fignoler tout ça).
    Si le Pion “Plein Gaz” existe déjà, je verrai bien une Gazette avec ce nouveau supplément de règles et peut être un scénario.
    Sinon une Gazette avec un Punch Board, le Pion “Plein Gaz” et divers correctifs…

  12. 9. Alan Hume said :

    sounds good, printing the rule as a card that comes with a related product would be great, you could just chuck it in the back of your current copy of the rules compendium then

  13. 8. Nemesis88 said :

    Ou si il a le jeton plein gaz, le véhicule à une sauvegarde d’armure de 6 ou 5.

  14. 7. Kingprawn said :

    Sorry, if I could adjust what I said, we rolled twice for damage and applied the worst.

  15. 6. Kingprawn said :

    Building on what’s proposed by Thia74, the light vehicles could take 2 damage. I’ve done this in the past, but it does allow the Zundap to be harder to deal with than it should be. I think with the above proposal slowing that pesky gnat down this will work well.

  16. 5. lloegyr said :

    Cette règle rendra les véhicule légers moins vulnérable et apportera une nouvelle dimension tactique au jeu…

  17. 4. netice said :

    j’aime bien l’idée

  18. 3. lex-talionis said :

    Simple à utiliser pour rendre les véhicules plus résistants aux assauts ou aux tirs à moyenne distance tout en faisant baisser leur force offensive s’ils roulent trop vite, ça sent bon !

  19. 2. gduprez said :

    Simple sur le papier mais pas à mettre en œuvre.

    C’est beaucoup trop puissant. Cela modifierait le coût des véhicules légers or comme indiqué, on ne veut pas de réimpression des options de recrutement dans le cahier des charges… ni aucune impression.

    Commençons par discuter de cette proposition avant que chacun propose une autre solution. 😉

  20. 1. thia74 said :

    L’autre solution et qui ne nécessite pas l’utilisation de nouveau pion est d’appliquer la règles des dégâts des véhicules lourd aux véhicules légers.

    Les légers sont alors plus résistants tout en ayant plus de menaces qu’un blindé lourd.

    Simple non ?